More long meta thoughts on Doctor Who
Mar. 29th, 2008 11:31 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
rynneIt's been so long since I was actively involved in a fandom with open canon (about three years, I think) that I forgot how many thoughts I could have, because there's so much we don't know, and don't know if we ever will know.
On that note, more DW thoughts. :p Pretty long, with some S4 casting spoilers.
Let me preface this by saying that Nine is my favorite Doctor. Though I love Ten to pieces, Nine is my favorite for myriad reasons--one of which is his character arc. And I can say that because I know the entire thing, from "Rose" to "The Parting of the Ways". Nine is about rediscovering life after something horribly traumatic, about finding something worth living for, and something worth dying for. I think his whole arc was absolutely beautiful, and I love it.
So while I lovelovelove Ten, I think the main reason he's not my favorite Doctor is because I don't know exactly where he's going. I have a few guesses, though.
Nine's character arc was rediscovering life, but I think Ten's is finding out who he is in the universe, now that he's started living again and is coming to terms with being the only Time Lord left. Which is where all that Lonely God stuff comes in.
I don't think Ten likes being thought of as a god. Nine may have been the one to say explicitly that he'd "make a very bad god", but it's not like Ten wants that mantle either. I don't have a transcript for "The Last of the Time Lords" handy, but we all know his plan to save the Earth was to make everyone believe in him at the same time. Still, given that, what is his reaction when everything's reset and no one knows who he is anymore? "That's as it should be", or something along those lines. He didn't want to be worshiped in "Boom Town" and he doesn't want to be worshiped now.
But he's still very aware of how powerful he is, especially in a universe without the Time Lords. The Doctor may always have been one for interfering, but I think several of the episodes wouldn't have happened, or would have been much more easily resolved, had Gallifrey still existed. Off-hand, I think the Doctor could have appealed to Gallifrey to fix things in "Father's Day", "The Parting of the Ways", possibly "Doomsday", and "The Sound of Drums"/"Last of the Time Lords". He might have got put on trial again, but at least everything wasn't on his shoulders. (Note that this is what I've picked up about Gallifrey on the internet--I haven't seen much Classic Who myself, so I might be wrong about that.)
And there are episodes emphasizing how powerful he is, as a Time Lord. In "School Reunion", Mr Finch tries pretty hard to get the Doctor to join them, and even given that they're trying to crack the Skasis Paradigm, I'm sure the prospect of having the Doctor's Time Lord attributes is pretty attractive. Then there's "Human Nature"/"Family of Blood", where the Doctor is targeted specifically because he's a Time Lord and the Family want that power for themselves.
So Ten is very aware of the power he holds, hence why he accepts the "Lonely God" designation, but it's not what he wants. The question becomes, what does he want?
He's actually not very subtle with this. In "Bad Wolf", back when he was Nine, he says explicitly, "All I'm after is a quiet life." In "Doomsday", he talks to Rose about how she'll be "living a life day after day. The one adventure I can never have." But his very word choice--calling it an adventure, saying he can't have it--makes me think it's not one he'd be averse to. In "Human Nature"/"Family of Blood", we find out he becomes human even though he really didn't have to--he was trying to be "merciful", which didn't really work out. I'm given the impression that the "hiding from the Family" was more of an excuse; his real reason for becoming human was to escape being the Doctor. John Smith nearly did live "the one adventure [the Doctor could] never have", and he wanted it. He very bravely decided to sacrifice it, but even at the end, the Doctor tells Joan that John Smith is inside him, that everything John is capable of, so is the Doctor. Then there's the utter hugeness of the end of "The Last of the Time Lords", where the Doctor volunteers to keep the Master prisoner in the TARDIS, just so he'd have something to care for. THE MASTER. He's so completely desperate for something constant in his life that he tries for it with THE MASTER, and despite surely knowing it would never work out like he'd want, he's so devastated when the Master refuses to regenerate. He loves his traveler's lifestyle, so I don't think he really wants to settle down, but I think he would be willing to if it meant he had something constant, something stable, and something to love.
Now there's the Doctor, who keeps being shoved in a role that was fine when he was just the renegade from Gallifrey, but now that he's one of the single most powerful beings in the universe, is something that just makes him lonely and so very, very tired. But because he's the Doctor and saving people is so very intrinsic to him that it's in the very name he chose, he keeps trying. He's aware that he's the "highest authority" available, and Ten's arc is about him trying to deal with that. Sometimes he goes overboard, like in "The Runaway Bride" and "The Family of Blood", but that's because he's trying to find his place in the scheme of things, and that doesn't happen without stumbling around a bit.
Except he was right, in "Boom Town". He does make a very bad god. His very stumbling around emphasizes it, the fact that he does go overboard. By going too far, the show proves that he needs to not do that--if RTD really had been building him up to end up as a God-figure, I think he'd do it by making the Doctor not do enough, to show that he needs to do more. But that's not what happens. Instead we get drowing the Racnoss, and Donna terrified. Instead we get inflicting horrific vengeance on the Family just because he can (and because they were the reason he had to stop his attempt at a normal life). Instead we get Mr Copper telling him at the end of "Voyage of the Damned" that if he could decide who lived and who died, he'd be a "monster".
RTD has brought up the "Lonely God" and "highest authority" stuff enough that we know it's going to have to be resolved. But he's also given us enough clues to know that becoming a sort of God would not do the Doctor or the universe any favors, and that's not where he's going.
Enter Rose Tyler, the girl he loved and who loved him in return, who promised him forever, who chose him over her family, who "made her choice and [is] never gonna leave [him]". In the "Doomsday" Confidential, RTD says that they basically had to get split up, that the Doctor was too close to settling down. And at that point, he was. But Rose's return is nearly a full two seasons after they were torn apart. He's been able to discover how very much he wants what she offered. He knew it before--I don't think it's any coincidence that Nine, who hated "domestic", regenerated into someone who would happily eat Christmas dinner with Rose's family, paper hats and all, or who ended up basically having a mother-in-law/son-in-law relationship with Jackie Tyler. He wanted that, but then it got taken away, and now he knows what he's lost. He tries to recreate it, a bit, by being really friendly to Martha's mother in "The Lazarus Experiment", but Francine Jones can't accept him the way Jackie came to, though Jackie had far more right to hate him. Throughout S3, and into "Voyage of the Damned", I think (I really do think Astrid reminded him of Rose), he keeps trying to recreate what he had with Rose and Rose's family, and failing miserably.
S2, to me, was the Doctor slowly coming to realize that he does want what Rose offers him, that loving her will be worth the pain of losing her. Then he loses her prematurely, and he finds out how very much he wants it, even needs it, is tired of being without it. And Rose is coming back.
RTD said that Rose's return was planned. But what ultimate purpose would her return serve? I know there are people who just want Rose and the Doctor to have closure, to be able to part on much better terms than "Doomsday", but how would that serve the Doctor's character arc? Just last season, he was able to part on good terms with two companions, Jack and Martha, not to mention the dozens of companions before them. This is nothing new for him. So what purpose could Rose's return serve if they're not going to do something different with her? Mickey and Jackie, the rest of the Doctor's adopted family, are also coming back--why, if they're just going to leave him alone again? RTD keeps saying that Doctor Who is about hope, but I see no hope in Rose, Mickey, and Jackie coming back just to leave again so soon, and more importantly, I don't see the point.
So what I think S4 will be about is the Doctor coming to terms with the fact that he doesn't have to be the Lonely God, that he can have his own life even with the power he holds. And I think getting Rose back is the culmination of that.
Of course, that doesn't mean that it will happen like this. I don't know where they would take the show after this, though I'm confident that they'd be able to find a way to entwine the Doctor having a life with his responsibilities to the universe. But really, that's a character arc for Ten that would make sense to me, and given the evidence, I don't think it's all that unlikely.
On that note, more DW thoughts. :p Pretty long, with some S4 casting spoilers.
Let me preface this by saying that Nine is my favorite Doctor. Though I love Ten to pieces, Nine is my favorite for myriad reasons--one of which is his character arc. And I can say that because I know the entire thing, from "Rose" to "The Parting of the Ways". Nine is about rediscovering life after something horribly traumatic, about finding something worth living for, and something worth dying for. I think his whole arc was absolutely beautiful, and I love it.
So while I lovelovelove Ten, I think the main reason he's not my favorite Doctor is because I don't know exactly where he's going. I have a few guesses, though.
Nine's character arc was rediscovering life, but I think Ten's is finding out who he is in the universe, now that he's started living again and is coming to terms with being the only Time Lord left. Which is where all that Lonely God stuff comes in.
I don't think Ten likes being thought of as a god. Nine may have been the one to say explicitly that he'd "make a very bad god", but it's not like Ten wants that mantle either. I don't have a transcript for "The Last of the Time Lords" handy, but we all know his plan to save the Earth was to make everyone believe in him at the same time. Still, given that, what is his reaction when everything's reset and no one knows who he is anymore? "That's as it should be", or something along those lines. He didn't want to be worshiped in "Boom Town" and he doesn't want to be worshiped now.
But he's still very aware of how powerful he is, especially in a universe without the Time Lords. The Doctor may always have been one for interfering, but I think several of the episodes wouldn't have happened, or would have been much more easily resolved, had Gallifrey still existed. Off-hand, I think the Doctor could have appealed to Gallifrey to fix things in "Father's Day", "The Parting of the Ways", possibly "Doomsday", and "The Sound of Drums"/"Last of the Time Lords". He might have got put on trial again, but at least everything wasn't on his shoulders. (Note that this is what I've picked up about Gallifrey on the internet--I haven't seen much Classic Who myself, so I might be wrong about that.)
And there are episodes emphasizing how powerful he is, as a Time Lord. In "School Reunion", Mr Finch tries pretty hard to get the Doctor to join them, and even given that they're trying to crack the Skasis Paradigm, I'm sure the prospect of having the Doctor's Time Lord attributes is pretty attractive. Then there's "Human Nature"/"Family of Blood", where the Doctor is targeted specifically because he's a Time Lord and the Family want that power for themselves.
So Ten is very aware of the power he holds, hence why he accepts the "Lonely God" designation, but it's not what he wants. The question becomes, what does he want?
He's actually not very subtle with this. In "Bad Wolf", back when he was Nine, he says explicitly, "All I'm after is a quiet life." In "Doomsday", he talks to Rose about how she'll be "living a life day after day. The one adventure I can never have." But his very word choice--calling it an adventure, saying he can't have it--makes me think it's not one he'd be averse to. In "Human Nature"/"Family of Blood", we find out he becomes human even though he really didn't have to--he was trying to be "merciful", which didn't really work out. I'm given the impression that the "hiding from the Family" was more of an excuse; his real reason for becoming human was to escape being the Doctor. John Smith nearly did live "the one adventure [the Doctor could] never have", and he wanted it. He very bravely decided to sacrifice it, but even at the end, the Doctor tells Joan that John Smith is inside him, that everything John is capable of, so is the Doctor. Then there's the utter hugeness of the end of "The Last of the Time Lords", where the Doctor volunteers to keep the Master prisoner in the TARDIS, just so he'd have something to care for. THE MASTER. He's so completely desperate for something constant in his life that he tries for it with THE MASTER, and despite surely knowing it would never work out like he'd want, he's so devastated when the Master refuses to regenerate. He loves his traveler's lifestyle, so I don't think he really wants to settle down, but I think he would be willing to if it meant he had something constant, something stable, and something to love.
Now there's the Doctor, who keeps being shoved in a role that was fine when he was just the renegade from Gallifrey, but now that he's one of the single most powerful beings in the universe, is something that just makes him lonely and so very, very tired. But because he's the Doctor and saving people is so very intrinsic to him that it's in the very name he chose, he keeps trying. He's aware that he's the "highest authority" available, and Ten's arc is about him trying to deal with that. Sometimes he goes overboard, like in "The Runaway Bride" and "The Family of Blood", but that's because he's trying to find his place in the scheme of things, and that doesn't happen without stumbling around a bit.
Except he was right, in "Boom Town". He does make a very bad god. His very stumbling around emphasizes it, the fact that he does go overboard. By going too far, the show proves that he needs to not do that--if RTD really had been building him up to end up as a God-figure, I think he'd do it by making the Doctor not do enough, to show that he needs to do more. But that's not what happens. Instead we get drowing the Racnoss, and Donna terrified. Instead we get inflicting horrific vengeance on the Family just because he can (and because they were the reason he had to stop his attempt at a normal life). Instead we get Mr Copper telling him at the end of "Voyage of the Damned" that if he could decide who lived and who died, he'd be a "monster".
RTD has brought up the "Lonely God" and "highest authority" stuff enough that we know it's going to have to be resolved. But he's also given us enough clues to know that becoming a sort of God would not do the Doctor or the universe any favors, and that's not where he's going.
Enter Rose Tyler, the girl he loved and who loved him in return, who promised him forever, who chose him over her family, who "made her choice and [is] never gonna leave [him]". In the "Doomsday" Confidential, RTD says that they basically had to get split up, that the Doctor was too close to settling down. And at that point, he was. But Rose's return is nearly a full two seasons after they were torn apart. He's been able to discover how very much he wants what she offered. He knew it before--I don't think it's any coincidence that Nine, who hated "domestic", regenerated into someone who would happily eat Christmas dinner with Rose's family, paper hats and all, or who ended up basically having a mother-in-law/son-in-law relationship with Jackie Tyler. He wanted that, but then it got taken away, and now he knows what he's lost. He tries to recreate it, a bit, by being really friendly to Martha's mother in "The Lazarus Experiment", but Francine Jones can't accept him the way Jackie came to, though Jackie had far more right to hate him. Throughout S3, and into "Voyage of the Damned", I think (I really do think Astrid reminded him of Rose), he keeps trying to recreate what he had with Rose and Rose's family, and failing miserably.
S2, to me, was the Doctor slowly coming to realize that he does want what Rose offers him, that loving her will be worth the pain of losing her. Then he loses her prematurely, and he finds out how very much he wants it, even needs it, is tired of being without it. And Rose is coming back.
RTD said that Rose's return was planned. But what ultimate purpose would her return serve? I know there are people who just want Rose and the Doctor to have closure, to be able to part on much better terms than "Doomsday", but how would that serve the Doctor's character arc? Just last season, he was able to part on good terms with two companions, Jack and Martha, not to mention the dozens of companions before them. This is nothing new for him. So what purpose could Rose's return serve if they're not going to do something different with her? Mickey and Jackie, the rest of the Doctor's adopted family, are also coming back--why, if they're just going to leave him alone again? RTD keeps saying that Doctor Who is about hope, but I see no hope in Rose, Mickey, and Jackie coming back just to leave again so soon, and more importantly, I don't see the point.
So what I think S4 will be about is the Doctor coming to terms with the fact that he doesn't have to be the Lonely God, that he can have his own life even with the power he holds. And I think getting Rose back is the culmination of that.
Of course, that doesn't mean that it will happen like this. I don't know where they would take the show after this, though I'm confident that they'd be able to find a way to entwine the Doctor having a life with his responsibilities to the universe. But really, that's a character arc for Ten that would make sense to me, and given the evidence, I don't think it's all that unlikely.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2008-03-31 08:56 pm (UTC)This is nothing new for him. So what purpose could Rose's return serve if they're not going to do something different with her? Mickey and Jackie, the rest of the Doctor's adopted family, are also coming back--why, if they're just going to leave him alone again? RTD keeps saying that Doctor Who is about hope, but I see no hope in Rose, Mickey, and Jackie coming back just to leave again so soon, and more importantly, I don't see the point.
Agreed. This is something that I've been batting around in my head as well, everyone keeps mentioning that they only think Rose is coming back for a few episodes and "closure" (whatever THAT'S supposed to mean when you're talking about someone you still love), but that just doesn't make sense to me. You've got it perfectly here.
Great meta on Ten. Saving to memories.
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 12:44 am (UTC)Oh, I'm glad. I've only seen S1 and S2 twice each, and S3 once, three months ago, so I'm really new to DW, and it's really good to hear I nailed the main character. :)
I just seriously don't see the point of Rose's return if they're just going to make her leave. Sarah Jane's return served a purpose--to make both the Doctor and Rose really look at this relationship they're developing, so they both know what it is they're getting into. Jack had even less closure in "Parting of the Ways" than Rose did in "Doomsday", so his return was inevitable, but I think his character arc (which I also love, and which is a whole 'nother post) pointed towards him leaving the Doctor and returning to Torchwood. Donna is returning to be the new companion, which is great, especially as I believe they're supposed to be just friends, which the Doctor really needs more of. Martha left herself open to return when she gave the Doctor her phone, but she also made it very clear that she wanted her own life back. We don't know much about Donna yet, but part of Jack's and Martha's arcs was that they had to leave him, to apply what they learned from him to their lives without him. But everything in Rose's character arc points towards her making the Doctor's life her own, and Ten's own arc shows how much he needs Rose.
Basically, I just don't see the point of Rose's return if she's not going to stay, and I think to take them apart again (especially if it's on good terms, where they move on) would be untrue to their journeys.
no subject
Date: 2008-03-31 11:22 pm (UTC)Also, I share the Nine love. He really did have an awesome arc, didn't he? And I always thought when Nine said to that couple in Father's Day, “I’ve traveled to all sorts of places, done things you couldn’t even imagine, but you two? Street corner, 2 in the morning, gettin’ a taxi home. I’ve never had a life like that.” that he was envious of them somewhat. Just to continue with the theme! :)
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 12:47 am (UTC)Yeah, I do think that line was sorta envious, but I think I had enough evidence for my point that I didn't need to use it. :p There were a bunch of things that I had in mind when I started this post, including how Nine could also be pretty "highest authority", but I just never found a good place to put those thoughts, and I think the overall post is pretty coherent as it is. ;)
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 12:29 am (UTC)There’s a part of me that wants to agree with this, but the closest I can get is “I liked season one best.” When I try to think of Nine and Ten as separate people, all I get is a headache.
Part of that’s because I started with “The Christmas Invasion,” and then went back and watched season one. But I think it’s mostly because of the storyline you’re describing—the Doctor’s journey from Lonely God to part of the Tyler family. I can see the beginnings of it all the way back in “Rose.”
But this is such a perfect summary that I almost feel like I’m nitpicking. And I think you’re absolutely right about where the story is going. So I’m just going to say “thank you” and leave it at that.
P.S. Do you mind if I friend you?
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 01:13 am (UTC)I watched everything in order, and I absolutely see the beginnings of the Doctor's integration into the Tyler family back in "Rose", and especially "Aliens of London"/"World War III". I also definitely think the Doctor's "highest authory" thing was very much a part of him as Nine, considering how he deals with Cassandra and Margaret the Slitheen. There's shades of Ten's arc in Nine, just as Nine's arc is part of Ten when he tries to find meaning in life after losing Rose, which emphasizes that they're the same person. Still, I like best what he was like and what his arc was when he was Nine. :)
Well, I hope I'm right about where the story is going! It definitely makes the most sense to me, hence this post, but there's always the possibility RTD goes off in a different direction...
Of course you can friend! *goes first* :D
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 01:36 am (UTC)I suppose the one place where I'd disagree is that I don't really think the Doctor wants a "normal" life; I think he envies it on some level, but he also really does love his crazy adventurous lifestyle and would be loathe to "settle down." I don't think it was just his duty to the universe that made him refuse to turn back into John Smith, and while he was willing to "settle down" with the Master, I'd blame that more on a combination of self-punishment and crushing loneliness.
I think what he does want is not to be alone; to share love, connection, and understanding with someone who will also share his adventurous life. Which is why Rose is perfect--because she is willing to share his life of travel and adventure, and her family is something stable that they can always go back to when things get rough. (Although, of course, there was always the tension in that Rose's family doesn't want to just wait around in the background, and Rose herself is only temporary for the Doctor.)
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 03:13 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-02 03:42 pm (UTC)I agree with everything you said here. I get bothered that a lot of people conflate "fulfilling life" with "normal life," when they're definitely not the same thing. A normal life isn't always fulfilling, and a fulfilling life isn't always normal.
And for the Doctor, I don't think he would find our idea of "normal" to be fulfilling, but like you pointed out, he definitely needs connections with other people in order to be happy. I see a lot of arguments that this means he should give up traveling and "settle down," but really I think this just means that he needs to find a balance between the two. Traveling the universe and saving people, but also opening up and connecting with others.
Anyway. Thank you again for the nifty post. :)
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 08:57 am (UTC)Remember "Love don't roam"?
"So reel me in, my precious girl
Come on, take me home
Cause my body’s tired of travelling
And my heart don’t wish to roam, yeah."
It's the Doctor's journey's end. He'll stop travelling to stay with Rose and have a lifetime with her (the 3 episodes in 2009).
Nine had said "Two o'clock in the morning, taking a taxi home, the one adventure I will never have" and then Ten said that too to Rose in Doomsday.
Well, he'll get this adventure... and we'll get our happy end.
Astrid showed him he could have romantic feelings again and his "daughter" will show him he wants and can do domestics an have his own family... but with the right person: Rose.
no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 11:56 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 07:17 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-01 11:57 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-02 07:02 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-02 09:15 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2008-04-15 03:53 am (UTC)He tries to recreate it you write, and I never consciously noticed it before, but he does.
This is fantastic. Thank you.